My Music
I really enjoy music mostly secular at the moment, but I recently rehashed some of my old christian music. Pulling from old Steven Curtis Chapman and Rich Mullins I actually felt a little uplifted by the lyrics of the songs. It was a nice change from the hopelessness I hear in most of my music as well as from the media (which I love). But I find myself at a crossroads.
I find that Christian music can be hookie and cliche and not really address whats going on with Christians. I don’t want to hear about how everything will be alright and God loves me because it seems like a brush off to the problems we face. On the other side of the coin is that these things are true for Christians everything will be alright in the end and God does love us, and I need to hear that because the world tries so hard to make me forget it. I feel like secular music is more likely to deal with the reality and grit of life but doesn’t offer and answer or hope for those problems.
Kinda feel like I am caught in a bind because I dont think that Christian music is cool but I see a need for it.
Yeah, I was just saying to my wife that it is funny that she and I have started listening to the Christian stations on the radio. I have such a dislike for a lot of what I hear. But I feel better for listening to it.
Why can’t more Christians make better music?
So are you asking, Is Christian music an oxymoron? Like military intelligence?
BP- I dont like your tone….lol and no I am not saying that. I think DC Talk did the Rock Rap thing years before the mainstream and in some aspects still did a better job. But I cant think of any bands that are leading the way now. This could be because I am out of the scene and have no one to be like oooooooh have you heard the new Twila Paris album its awesome, or it could be because the Christian Music industry is fine with following whatever the secular market is doing.
I have found skillet which I really like (although I am not sure its something I would play at church on Sunday…but maybe) they are kind of a cross between Evanescence and Breaking Benjamin (without the cussing) and they do it well.
So any suggestions? I love Derek Webb but there is only so much conviction I can take in a given day.
Come on lets get some Bride and Stryper going. “To Hell With the Devil” could be the theme midi music on the site. lol
But seriously, I would have to say that Christians in the music scene have come a LONG way in the past 10 to 15 years. Part of that great growth has been a departure from pure CCM marketing and identification. Some may say that this was a new phenomenon, but people like Larry Norman (thanks Gene for the intro to him) and Keith Green were out there with clear Christian messages in the 70s, but just with good music backing it. Now I think that there are a ton of great bands out there on normal music labels who are clearly Christian (Great Lake Swimmers, Dolorean, Sufjan Stevens), and don’t feel the need to market themselves only to Christian labels and be sold in Christian bookstores. I love the fact that I have been introduced to some of these bands by friends who care nothing for the Gospel, but like really good music.
And that is a good direction for so-called Christian music.
Oh, still twitching from that “Twila Paris” comment.
This brings back so many memories of rabid ranting about all that “CCM over-produced Nashvegas sound lowest common denominator targeted…” – and that was just from this morning’s commute. OK, not really, but it did come up Saturday when somebody played Katy Perry, I mean Katy Hudson, I mean, that girl who was a major CCM artist a couple years ago but has most recently been the cause of a very serious, difficult discussion with a 12 year old. Then that makes me thing of the news from last week about Roy Boltz’s lifestyle admission.
That didn’t garner nearly the media notice, though, that the aformentioned SCC family tragedy did from a few months ago. Hard to believe since it was the least “gossipy”.
All that said, and all the other Nashvegas “indiscretions” considered, it would make a lot more sense that CCM songwriters would have a deeper grasp on the brokenness off this world.
NEway! Back to the point. There’s always been a vein of “good” music from Christians, somewhere.
Sufjan Steven’s actually has a little cadre of really awesome artists on Asthmatic Kitty records. But they kind of embody one of the most difficult things about music these days; everybody’s trying really hard to be Christians who are musicians, or musicians who just happen to be Christian. That’s what caused an abrupt implosion in the local concert scene in 2001 – all the most popular [indie] bands decided they were only playing bars and “non-Christian” venues.
Sadly, either from lack of proximity, or my encroaching foggey-ish-ness, I’m not entirely sure who to listen to currently.
Crabb, very glad to know that you feel the Illiniose.
[Does anyone else feel I have some pent-up issues related to this topic?]
I’m really, *really* glad that CX mention Skillet. Great band, great music, great lyrics, and really great people. John and Corey Cooper are 2 of the nicest people I ever met. It’s been awesome to see that they’re still doing what they do, *and* staying relevant to their audience, even with kids and stuff. But their first 2 albums are my personal go to for “heavy” praise and worship. Well, maybe less P&W, more “here I am, God, to be kicked in the face like I deserve, but instead you love me…” That’s a rough summation of a lot of the early stuff. There’s something to be said for headbanging while crying your heart out… As for playing at church? Well, I *do* have sound this Sunday…
Kind of in the other direction, there’s a band called Brave Saint Saturn. Another band that makes me cry, but only on some of the songs. It’s 4 members (sometimes more) of 5 Iron Frenzy, if you remember the beauty and joy that they were, and all the angst that Reece didn’t bring to the FIF albums. The songs of first 2 albums seem to be about either Redemption and our neediness, or ex-fiancees. Which makes me wonder what’s going to be on the 3 and final album, due out now, since Reece got married since the last one.
Dang it! Time to go home! I should know better than even start about this topic! Maybe I’ll post a follow up of just some other bands you could check out, after I get home and remember.
Oh yeah, have you heard Mae? Or, um… [must ... stop ... click ... submit...]
Storm I will wait to respond until after you finish your thought.
Crabb, this brings up an interesting question for me. What constitutes Christian music? The fact that a Christian made it or does it have to have actual spiritual content? Just because I am a Christian who does design doesn’t mean that Equifax’s new e-invoices are Christian invoices.
If a Christian musician writes a song about love or struggle with no reference to God or Jesus, I don’t think its right to make the assumption that it’s Christian music if it could just as easily be applied to a woman or constipation.
Yeah, I used to listen to a lot of the old school Christian music and I eventually felt like it just didn’t really deal with the real things that Christians face in everyday life. Now I try to look for bands that have a balance of the struggles that we face and the hope that we have. These bands are not very easy to find, but I feel like the band 12 Stones does a very job at this. And while you definitely wouldn’t hear any of their songs played in church, I feel like they are very real and don’t try to gloss over anything.
Muah ha ha ha with Storm and I on sound you can never tell what will be played at our church. We like to keep Yimmy guessing and a little uncertain (love you Yimmy).
What constitutes P&W music? That’s my question. If,for example, a person were to release a gospel album and NOT believe in the content of the album, could it really be called gospel music? Or, I were to listen to the album, could I honestly and with my whole heart praise God?
Bands…Brave Saint Saturn,Bernard,Yellow Second,December Radio,Rocket Summer,NEEDTOBREATHE,Seven Day Jesus,Micah Dalton,Jurny Big,The Benjamin Gate…Color Theory,is the music “Christian” or not?
OK, so, before my list, I wanna throw in a couple things.
First, this Sunday, we’re just gonna bring a bunch of stuff for whoever wants to borrow and listen.
Second. This is an old example I used to use to try to explain my thoughts on the “what is Christian music” question to some southern baptists.
Take, for instance, a rock. Can that rock be Christian? Did Jesus die for that rock? If I, being a Christian, paint a big, glittery cross on that rock, is it then? What if I give it to someone to make them smile? What if I throw it at someone’s head because they made fun of the fish on my car? What if it’s blessed by the pope? Dipped in the Jordan? Sold in the Christian bookstore for $9.99?
Yeah, no.
Of course, there’s a lot to be said for the “spirit” conveyed by the music. Techno music played by Christians, re: Prodigal Sons [oh my gosh, best praise and worship experiences I've ever had], “feels” a whole lot different from something from, say, Fatboy Slim or Prodigy. And that even depends on where my heart and mind are at the moment.
But, ultimately, it comes down to a baseline, in our culture, at least, of music being a product. Its so much easier for us to go to walmart, open the music cooler, and just look – “whole music, chocolate music, 2% music, skim music, ah, Christian music!” Maybe we check the expiration date, then we check out, rush home, and pour ourselves a big ol’ glass and eat a cookie with it. Don’t worry about what kind of cow it came from, what it ate, who milked it, is it GMO free – its enough for us that “somebody” decided it was Christian, so I can be lazy and eat my cookie without feeling guilty.
And to spin the topic a whole ‘nother direction, did you know that a major portion of Disney’s kiddie music roster at least started out in the “Christian” circuit? That’s right, even the Jonas Brothers are struggling with the question of the the hour. I read an article not long ago from a journalist who was a little shocked to realize the number of “Christian” artists being courted by mainstream secular labels, labels who cited the better *quality* of music, and the experience the artists had acquired playing churches and Christian venues.
Or, all that to say, IMHO, “Christian music” = another product to keep all us lazy sheep in our pews and on our couches, or at least in our ghettos, feeling so much better than all those sinners listening to Damien Rice, or whoever.
BTW, when Guitar Praise comes out this Christmas [that's right, Christian Guitar Hero], I’m gonna own you *all* on “Jesus Freak”! Yeah, baby!
OK, I had a point. Yeah. I like these bands. Maybe you will too.
Older stuff
Steve Taylor – the 80′s stuff is, well, 80′s, but the Squint album from the 90′s could still hold up. Earned his blacklisting with a song about a psycho ice cream truck driver bent on blowing up abortion clinics. Great stuff!
Hoi Polloi – early 90′s band from New Zealand. Spectacular period alt.rock.
Daniel Amos, The Swirling Eddies, Adam Again, The 77s, The Choir, Lost Dogs… – there was this whole “thing” in California spanning like 30 years, and there was a *lot* of really amazing music.
moving forward
Stavesacre – Heavy, but not screamy. Big scary bald man staring at you from stage while he sings really insightful lyrics. ***Great*** live…
see also, Living Sacrifice
Deitiphobia – Dark electronic, almost gothic. Older stuff is better.
[there *was* in fact a "Christian" goth music scene for a little while, with some really good music - Wedding Party, Savior Machine. Good times...]
Madison Greene – world music, hippies, digeridoos and hand drums. Oh yeah.
Over the Rhine – Yeah, I know, if you know Derek Webb, and Caedmon’s, et al… But OTR just had to be said.
newer stuff (or at least as new as I get)
Joy Electric – not for everybody. Dang I wish everybody was cool enough to listen to this band. Clone a fusion of Mozart and Tolkein, then only expose him to 80′s video game music, then let him write. You’d get about halfway to the beauty that is Joy Electric. I could listen to it all day, but people would kill me for being too happy.
The Echoing Green – again, personal favourite. Everything great about 80′s electronica. With beautiful, thoughtful lyrics.
Havalina Rail Company – Americana Rock and Roll. Very diverse. Now defunct. New band is Matt Death and the New Intellectuals. Still trying to find more than 1 song by them.
Mute Math – used to be most of the band Earthsuit. very electronic rock. Did a spec-friggin-tacular cover of the Transformers theme on the movie soundtrack.
OneOneSixClique – Rap, fused with some rock vibe. Good stuff.
The Almost
The Turning
Underoath
Willow
and, dang it, tobyMac’s new stuff is pretty good. There, I said it.
And now that I’ve typed all this, I realize I should have just pointed you to “The Bored-Again Christian” podcast. http://BoredAgainChristian.com
I expect to see everyone become FB friends with JustPete very soon.
Can I go to bed now? Sheesh!!!!
Profblades – Sorry I didn’t respond to your question until now, not sure how it slipped by me. I think that there are some really great Christian musicians out there, but its tough for them to find their niche. The secular world wants their songs to be about generic love and not about God or Jesus. And the CCM scene wants a dumbed down, non-offensive version of Christianity that a five year old can embrace. The only problem with both of these is that neither is focused on the struggling Christian adult. I have a HUGE problem shopping at Christian book stores, because they black balled Derek Webb’s first album because he used the words bastard and whore. Why must we always dilute the truth? Why my our need for God less? It is one thing to say that I am bad but God loves me anyway and another to say
“so could you love this bastard child
though i don’t trust you to provide
with one hand in a pot of gold
and with the other in your side
i am so easily satisfied
by the call of lovers less wild
that i would take a little cash
over your very flesh and blood
i am a whore i do confess
but i put you on just like a wedding dress
and i run down the aisle
i’m a prodigal with no way home
but i put you on just like a ring of gold
and i run down the aisle to you”
Raine – If a person were to release a gospel album and NOT believe in the content of the album, could it really be called gospel music? – I think is a great question, as far as the bands you listed I am waaay out of the Christian and Pseudo Christian loops so I haven’t heard of any of them. Since you seem pretty knowledgeable on the subject who would you suggest as far as Christian musicians go?
Storm – Have you thought of writing a book? lol jk. I will have to check out some of this stuff, nice list. And as far as tobyMac’s new stuff being cool I agree, but none of it compares to any of the dc stuff they were doing at the end. I think the combination of Tait, T-max, and K-max made an unreproducible mix. Also I am tired of being depressed about my music. I dont want to start listening to a band and fall in love with them only to realize that they have already broken up or the lead singer died 10 years ago, dang you Queen dang you.
hahaha Yeah, I’m totally with you. I’m tired of “Christian” bookstores having a great selection only so long as someone works there that cares. Gone are the days of going to the store and knowing who to ask about what’s good. And I pray I never see another “Christian vs. Secular” comparison chart -
Tupak Shakur = DC Talk
Metallica = Petra
CCM’s “next big thing” = Lifehouse [wait, aren't they already... nevermind...]
I’m already tired of the fact that I have to order anything new from artists I do like from their websites. I miss being excited on Tuesdays.
And, yeah. So with you on liking a band only to find out they’ve broken up or died. But, on the other hand, if they’d have kept going, they could have turned into Petra or Carmen [Oh yeah, I went there...
], so maybe we should just be happy to have the good stuff.
Have you listened to Bored-Again yet? Have ya, huh?
oh Carmen what happened……
and yeah I went over to Bored-Again and the podcast is pretty sweet seems to be right up the alley of this conversation. Thanks Storm
Another cool thing is NoiseTrade pay what you want music or email it to some friends and get it for free (co-founded by derek webb).
I have a healthy respect for all bands listed and will make sure the albums make it into the aforementioned ‘can o’goods’ for service on Sunday. Would love to hear your opinion after listening the the music.
excitement?.. anticipation?.. I believe it is.
Well I guess I’m the loser for not checking back sooner after one snide remark!
Storm, you SHOULD write a book or an article or something. I’ll get it published. You have too much to say to not say it! It must be all that time being a carpenter (signmaker is a carpenter of plastic) that makes you think so well.
CX, I’m just going on record, I’m old. Storms list lost me right after Daniel Amos. I’m a relic. Set me up a record player and I’ll break out some Larry Norman, Randy Stonehill, Pat Terry, Dogwood and Love Song. I have a smattering of CDs now and they are mostly jazz – real jazz. Christian jazz because I listen to them… with Jesus. During my 7 week recovery for the bionic toe (doing well btw) I only listened to jazz.
I barely kept up during the 90s as a Jr Hi pastor, but since 95-96, I lost interest, then my oldest turned 12 and I was banned from all music discussions…
And last comment, I am PROUD to say all three of my children were weaned onto ALL rock music via dcTalk Jesus Freak. And one of my daughters knows EVERY lyric to every song. Best CD I purchased in the 90s. You have GOT to get her to do the raps for you. Makes a man tear up in a manly sort of way.
Rock on in the postlude! Keep them Christians guessing!
Randy Stonehill, yeah I had that on vinyl too. And remind me to ask about the raps on Sunday I’ll get her a mic.
Rock on in the postlude! Keep them Christians guessing!
And I would be careful with that one Storm is craaaaaazy and he probably has even crazier music.
Come on lets get some Bride and Stryper going. “To Hell With the Devil” could be the theme midi music on the site. lol
But seriously, I would have to say that Christians in the music scene have come a LONG way in the past 10 to 15 years. Part of that great growth has been a departure from pure CCM marketing and identification. Some may say that this was a new phenomenon, but people like Larry Norman (thanks Gene for the intro to him) and Keith Green were out there with clear Christian messages in the 70s, but just with good music backing it. Now I think that there are a ton of great bands out there on normal music labels who are clearly Christian (Great Lake Swimmers, Dolorean, Sufjan Stevens), and don't feel the need to market themselves only to Christian labels and be sold in Christian bookstores. I love the fact that I have been introduced to some of these bands by friends who care nothing for the Gospel, but like really good music.
And that is a good direction for so-called Christian music.